Force Inclinations

  • HesinRaca
  • HesinRaca's Avatar
  • Guest
04 Apr 2007 23:31 #467 by HesinRaca
Replied by HesinRaca on topic Force Inclinations
War_Beauty wrote:

well. My friend and i were just disscussing this matter....and i thought of a way to describe the Shadow Jedi.

Someone who believes in God and is atheist at the same time.



I don't know if I would agree with that. I think it would be more apt to consider a true neutral shadow Jedi, one who believes in pure neutrality to be similiar to being both a faithful follower of Zeus and a faithful follower of Hades. You can't follow zeus and hades, it pulls you apart. You can't follow Jesus and Lucifer. Their docterines contradict. What you can do, and this is what I believe Dhagon Krayt is saying(correct if wrong), is that it is entirely plausable and highly benificial to follow the light side and its docterines, and yet understand and expierence the dark side to know its workings. The Jedi code would suggest you do thish through controlled meditation on your dark emotions, but I am under the impression that Dhagon, you would consider a more active understanding of the dark side to be necessary? Could you elaborate on that? Do you mean that in order to understand a thief we must steal, or understand a rapist we must rape? Because I think you are more in agreement with the concept of controlled meditation that of truely expierencing. Please elaborate on what you mean by \"expierencing the dark side to understand it\".

Please Log in to join the conversation.

  • War Beauty
  • War Beauty's Avatar
  • Guest
05 Apr 2007 04:36 #487 by War Beauty
Replied by War Beauty on topic Force Inclinations
but if one REALLY studied the Shadow side of life..then they would know that Shadow Jedi study, piously, both aspects to the force. there is nothing wrong with using one side and understanding the other. But such is not hte Shadow Jedi. they use BOTH sides, or thy can not call themselves true shadow jedi. Light and Sith are contradicting views. so, i feel what i said was vaild. Being a shadow jedi is like being atheist and believing in God at the smae time.

Please Log in to join the conversation.

  • HesinRaca
  • HesinRaca's Avatar
  • Guest
05 Apr 2007 05:35 #488 by HesinRaca
Replied by HesinRaca on topic Force Inclinations
That is a fair assertion, and I think you have the concept of shadow jedi down very well, I definitly agree with that, but if athiest is \"a person who denies or disbelieves the existence of a supreme being or beings.\" then would not believing in God negate the atheism of a person, or visa versa? The shadow jedi's use of the dark side does not negate her use of the light, nor does it imply a contradiction, because the shadow jedi do not embrace both creeds of the jedi and sith but instead have their own creed. Thoughts?

Please Log in to join the conversation.

  • Twsoundsoff
  • Twsoundsoff's Avatar
  • Guest
05 Apr 2007 07:17 #490 by Twsoundsoff
Replied by Twsoundsoff on topic Force Inclinations
This creed is however an amalgamation of the two, and as such is somewhat contradictory to itself. Let us look at the shadow jedi code and break it down.

I am at Peace; for I know Emotion.

This of course is true for all Jedi shadow or light. Only by knowing our emotions can we master them and ultimately master ourselves.

I have Power; for I also have Knowledge.

It may be true that knowledge is power but true Jedi do not strive for power. we strive to understand The Force in an effort to know its will so that we may help it come to fruition. 2. Believe in the Force and its power, a Jedi is devoted to the Force, being committed to the ideals of a Jedi is a pervading tenet. A Jedi does not serve the dark side in any way, in thought or in deed. A Jedi acts in a righteous manner defining the principles of a true Jedi. Knowledge and a relationship will you develop with the Force, it resides within you, surrounds you and flows through you.

I have Passion; for I am Serene.

Serenity does not denote passion. when one is serene they are happy or blissful. where does the passion come into that except being passionate about being serene?

I can embrace Mortality; for I know Death

One of the basic teachings of the Jedi put this one to bed.
12. Jedi believe in eternal life. We do not become obsessed in mourning those who pass into the Force. Grieve as you will but take heart, for the soul and spirit continue in the netherworld of the Living Force.
Hence the portion of the orthodox code that says \"There is no Death: there is only the Force\"

And finally- I am balanced through the Force.

This goes against the second law of thermodynamics. There can be no balance. The second law states in simple terms \"Energy flows only from being concentrated in one place
to becoming diffused or dispersed and spread out.\" See, no balance. This is essentially chaos begets more chaos and if a Jedi seeks for a time the dark side to study they are breeding chaos within themselves. not evening it out. As Ginsburg said about this Law \"you can't break even\"

to follow this I want to point out one thing from our own doctrine.

\"Jedi follow what is considered to be the Light Side of the Force, and adhere to the ideals and philosophies of the Jedi religion.\"

Please Log in to join the conversation.

  • Dhagon Krayt
  • Dhagon Krayt's Avatar
  • Guest
05 Apr 2007 12:45 #493 by Dhagon Krayt
Replied by Dhagon Krayt on topic Force Inclinations
HesinRaca wrote:
Their docterines contradict. What you can do, and this is what I believe Dhagon Krayt is saying(correct if wrong), is that it is entirely plausable and highly benificial to follow the light side and its docterines, and yet understand and expierence the dark side to know its workings. The Jedi code would suggest you do thish through controlled meditation on your dark emotions, but I am under the impression that Dhagon, you would consider a more active understanding of the dark side to be necessary? Could you elaborate on that? Do you mean that in order to understand a thief we must steal, or understand a rapist we must rape? Because I think you are more in agreement with the concept of controlled meditation that of truely expierencing. Please elaborate on what you mean by \"expierencing the dark side to understand it\".

No, I do not believe we should steal to understand a theif, or rape to understand a rapist. I do however (like you put it) think there should be a more active aproach in understanding it. The meditation of your feelings and emotions is great, and if you can do that and get a good understanding of it great, those are definately some of the first steps in fully understanding the dark side. I believe (at least how it worked in my experience) that the next step, is to learn when NOT to do things you would normally do as a Jedi to help others. There are times when our helping someone would in fact hurt them more in the long run. Sure your commiting an act against the Jedi code, but its actually going to help them more. You see, I think that I'm being severly misunderstood in all this. I am NOT an advocate for the dark side, I'm not saying commit lots of evil acts and try to take over the world. I'm just talking about more balance. Light cannot shine everywhere all at once. I'm mostly saying that sometimes its necessary to do something seemingly evil to better the whole, it will balance out. So Hesin, to kind of answer your question, no I'm not talking about meditating on your emotions to know the dark side, sometimes its necessary to act in an evil way. Shadow Jedi from what I understand thus far, use either acts of good or acts of evil to set forth the means that will accomplish the end that the Force has given them the motivation for.

Also, it seems that I have somehow became the voice of the Shadow Jedi, I guess this is mostly my own fault for speaking up so much, but this is something I never intended. I do concider myself a Shadow Jedi, but I'm not sure I'm any kind of expert on the matter either. I'm no master, and aside from becoming an ordained minister, I'm not even a Knight. I don't even know if there are any other Shadow Jedi here. I'd like to speak with some others that share my views of the Force, if there are any out there.

On another note though, alot of the things people put into their posts to contradict most of the things I say, are from the 16 teachings and other things of the Jedi. Remember, that they do not, and will not match up with the things I say, the 16 teachings, and so forth were written (atleast in my eyes) for light side Jedi. The teachings and doctrine and so forth don't seem to be written to allow for any other view, I guess thats where it has lots in common with most other religious books. There are parts of the teachings and doctrine and so forth that I agree with, but some that I do not. So by using these to contradict what I say, is kind of useless since I don't embrace every word of them. If I were a better writer and better with words, I would attempt atleast to write similar documents geared toward multi-faceted beliefs or geared toward other beliefs individually. Unfortunately I have not been blessed with those talents.

Dhagon Krayt

Please Log in to join the conversation.

  • Dhagon Krayt
  • Dhagon Krayt's Avatar
  • Guest
05 Apr 2007 12:46 #494 by Dhagon Krayt
Replied by Dhagon Krayt on topic Force Inclinations
Why does that always happen?

Please Log in to join the conversation.

  • Twsoundsoff
  • Twsoundsoff's Avatar
  • Guest
05 Apr 2007 14:55 #498 by Twsoundsoff
Replied by Twsoundsoff on topic Force Inclinations
I have no idea but it is rather annoying I agree

Please Log in to join the conversation.

  • War Beauty
  • War Beauty's Avatar
  • Guest
05 Apr 2007 14:59 #501 by War Beauty
Replied by War Beauty on topic Force Inclinations
sorry, let me reprase myself. a shadow Jedi is someone who worships god and satan at the same time. ignore what i said earlier. that was spur of the moment. i have had time to think and reconsider the matter and that's what i came up with. so the views are contradicting, but polar oppisites.

Please Log in to join the conversation.

  • jidun
  • jidun's Avatar
  • Guest
05 Apr 2007 15:07 #503 by jidun
Replied by jidun on topic Force Inclinations
Dhagon Krayt wrote:

Why does that always happen?


I am going to have to ferret out the code that makes the stupid pop-up that asks if you want to re-post due to some error if you see it just click cancel. You may want to right click select all and copy your post first but, it is annoying tends to happen on long post compositions.

Please Log in to join the conversation.

  • Twsoundsoff
  • Twsoundsoff's Avatar
  • Guest
05 Apr 2007 15:15 #504 by Twsoundsoff
Replied by Twsoundsoff on topic Force Inclinations
Ok, so then the directive is to press cancel when that pops up. You got it. and thank you for all your help with this as well. We would not have this wonderful site without you, and for that I think I can speak for us all when I say you are greatly appreciated and admired for your work. MTFBWY

Please Log in to join the conversation.

Moderators: RexZero