Busy minds during meditation?

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05 Dec 2012 01:59 #82564 by Proteus
When you're not meditating, through the day, intentionally practice something:

Choose a thought or pattern of thoughts to decide to think about.

Think about them.

While you think about them, imagine a voice saying "I see you are thinking about this, aren't you?"

You might imagine it is another entity of some kind observing your thoughts and talking to you about them.

Or you might be imagining that you are actually the other entity observing your thoughts.

This practice helps you instinctively remove yourself from being subject to the thoughts and instead, being an outside observer. The more you actively practice this day to day, the easier it gets to stand outside your thoughts as you meditate, and control them by letting them drift by like clouds. Eventually you notice fewer and fewer clouds until there are no more left (or that even if there are, they do not matter or distract you).

It seems that I know that I know.
What I would like to see is the 'I' that knows me when I know that I know that I know.
- Alan Watts

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05 Dec 2012 03:16 #82571 by Br. John
Why Is it Impossible to Stop Thinking, to Render the Mind a Complete Blank?

www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?i...ble-to-stop-thinking

(Don't miss some good comments after the article on the Scientific American site.)


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05 Dec 2012 03:33 #82577 by Adder
Replied by Adder on topic Busy minds during meditation?

Br. John wrote: Why Is it Impossible to Stop Thinking, to Render the Mind a Complete Blank?

www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?i...ble-to-stop-thinking


Interesting article thanks, I'd like to think we can have thought processes going on in the subconscious. Often I've lost something and ask myself to think about it, distract myself and then ask for the answer and remember it. So we might not stop thinking, and I think it gets shifted to the subconscious...... or our minds can learn to envelope a lower importance conscious train of thought in a temporary non-conscious mode to run silently to completion in the background, like a simple organelle (to steal a biology term).

Knight ~ introverted extropian, mechatronic neurothealogizing, technogaian buddhist. Likes integration, visualization, elucidation and transformation.
Jou ~ Deg ~ Vlo ~ Sem ~ Mod ~ Med ~ Dis
TM: Grand Master Mark Anjuu

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05 Dec 2012 15:50 - 05 Dec 2012 16:27 #82624 by Rickie The Grey
Replied by Rickie The Grey on topic Busy minds during meditation?
This is how I do it:

I don't meditate daily as I should. Preparing myself physically, mentally and emotionally is important. Min alcohol, caffein, proper diet and mild exercise set the stage . It sometimes takes several days of preparation if I am to have my best meditation experience. I sit in a lazyboy chair or lay down to support my back. Cramps in my back and legs from sitting upright or the lotus position are too much of a distraction for me to get into a deep enough relaxed state to explore my mind.

My mind and emotions have to be calm when I start or I spend my meditation calming myself and get no farther. Once sitting comfortable for a few min and am settled in I focus on breath counting in a ten count cycle 10Xs. Takes between 10-15 min for the first cycle. If my count messes up or my thoughts wander I start the count over. The perfect counting or the time it takes to complete ten cycles is not important. Gently bring my focus back and breath counting is my focus. When thoughts creep in I've trained myself to mentally say "Not now." &or "Let it go." picturing myself letting the thought (& the tension, physical response, that came with the thought) go off and drift away, This takes practice but it does become reflexive over time. It really helps a lot.

When I am deeply relaxed the best stuff is experienced. It may take 30 min of breath counting to get there and I can rarely meditate 45 or more so if it doesn't happen I only had a relaxing session and that is OK. My body/mind gets a lot of benefit from deep relaxation. I'm there when my breathing is slippery. Slippery is not a word I chose. I read about it years ago about meditation and didn't realize it until it happened. It's like I'm observing myself breath on auto pilot just like you would when asleep.

This state where I'm "observing myself" is where it's at for me right now. I watch and direct my thoughts at will while feeling open and merged with the universe. These words do not do this state justice. My thoughts can direct my consciousness from the tip of my little toe to an eyelash. I try to stay to open to anything that may come to me. I often ask the energy of the cosmos to, "Cleanse me, heal me, strengthen me." In this state I can ponder on what comes into my mind with out attachment and let them drift off again. It can be in vivid detail or just airy . The feeling of my thoughts and feelings radiating, flowing or rippling from me is mind expanding. I feel part of everything all at once and have no sense of time or space.

This does not happens all the time but when it does it is special. It is a WOW experience.

I have never shared this with anyone before is such detail and am hesitant about putting it on the WWW.
Last edit: 05 Dec 2012 16:27 by Rickie The Grey.

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  • Alluvius
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05 Dec 2012 18:13 #82637 by Alluvius
Replied by Alluvius on topic Busy minds during meditation?

maynoth wrote: I recommend using an mp3 of rain, or a thunderstorm to meditate to. It helps drown out monkey mind chatter.


:woohoo:

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05 Dec 2012 23:13 #82669 by maynoth
Replied by maynoth on topic Busy minds during meditation?

Alluvius wrote:

maynoth wrote: I recommend using an mp3 of rain, or a thunderstorm to meditate to. It helps drown out monkey mind chatter.


:woohoo:


en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monkey_mind

Mind monkey or monkey mind, from Chinese xinyuan and Sino-Japanese shin'en 心猿 [lit. "heart-/mind-monkey"], is a Buddhist term meaning "unsettled; restless; capricious; whimsical; fanciful; inconstant; confused; indecisive; uncontrollable".


The MP3 tracks I made are free to use and share, I find they genuinely help me, and I hope they help other people who want to meditate but are bombarded with mind chatter.

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06 Dec 2012 00:58 #82675 by Alluvius
Replied by Alluvius on topic Busy minds during meditation?
oh sure...just ruin the humor ;)

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06 Dec 2012 01:43 #82679 by Alluvius
Replied by Alluvius on topic Busy minds during meditation?

maynoth wrote: The MP3 tracks I made are free to use and share, I find they genuinely help me, and I hope they help other people who want to meditate but are bombarded with mind chatter.


If we need something to help drown the monkeys, may I offer that tuning a radio to a station with just static will achieve the same purpose. All you're really looking for is just any type of white-noise. If you're more into rhythmic stuff and can't afford gongs and don't know any meditation chants...a metronome will due quite nicely.

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06 Dec 2012 11:46 #82706 by maynoth
Replied by maynoth on topic Busy minds during meditation?

Alluvius wrote:

maynoth wrote: The MP3 tracks I made are free to use and share, I find they genuinely help me, and I hope they help other people who want to meditate but are bombarded with mind chatter.


If we need something to help drown the monkeys, may I offer that tuning a radio to a station with just static will achieve the same purpose. All you're really looking for is just any type of white-noise. If you're more into rhythmic stuff and can't afford gongs and don't know any meditation chants...a metronome will due quite nicely.


I can't speak for all people everywhere, but my experience with white noise was very negative and I found it not conducive to meditation. Perhaps for sensory deprivation, and Ganzfeld experiments, but not for meditation.

A metronome might be useful in hypnosis, but again I am not sure if it is the right tool for the job, same goes for a candle or any other object of focus.

At least not for the type of meditation I study, there are many types of meditation so different strokes for different folks I guess.

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06 Dec 2012 13:01 #82712 by Alluvius
Replied by Alluvius on topic Busy minds during meditation?

maynoth wrote: I can't speak for all people everywhere, but my experience with white noise was very negative and I found it not conducive to meditation. Perhaps for sensory deprivation, and Ganzfeld experiments, but not for meditation.


What do you think that ocean wave sounds are, or music tracks for meditation? They're just forms of white-noise. White-noise is a word for "background sounds" it provides a quasi-focus for your conscious mind that can easily be "tuned out" when it's no longer needed.

maynoth wrote: A metronome might be useful in hypnosis, but again I am not sure if it is the right tool for the job, same goes for a candle or any other object of focus.


What's the practical, definable difference between a gong and a metronome? Personally I don't gain much benefit from gongs...or any other sort of rhythmic tone including chanting and metronomes. But in practical terms, there's no definable, meditative difference between one or another.

maynoth wrote: ...there are many types of meditation so different strokes for different folks I guess.


I suppose that's true, and like I already said, I gain no benefit from gongs (and what-not), but white-noise, in any form, is ultimately useful to me. I don't often feel the need to drown monkeys however, and tend to meditate "raw" and unassisted, so maybe my opinion is unqualified in this matter...

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