Jedi and Drugs

A fascinating article on drug addiction-
'The Likely Cause of Addiction has been discovered, and it's not what you think'

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/johann-hari/the-real-cause-of-addicti_b_6506936.html

I wonder how this applies to other ideas- pornography, gambling, any high really- perhaps what we're lacking is simply that positive human contact with one another...

Thought that was interesting and relevant to this topic- enjoy reading.

I don't disagree, save when it comes to cigarettes. That's totally a chemical OR oral addiction. Depends on the person. Of course, I've personally watched people that when they got the attention, they relapsed because they just couldn't take the human connection anymore. They felt it was fake when their smoking (marijuana) buddies seemed more real.

The problem is a lot more complex than human connection. Sometimes people CANNOT break the habit because they have a hook on a certain lifestyle (not chemical, but a lifestyle). I actually know this guy that works with drug addicts one-on-one using more spiritual concepts. Gets them meditating, using saunas (a lot of things you would think of when you think "Sedona, AZ"). He seems to be effective.

I suspect that connections with people is still an influencing factor on cigarettes though.
My fiance is finding it impossible to quit while we still have a lodger than smokes.

Thanks V.
Glad to see the twice removed new book on the drug wars.

It is my opinion that the results of the 1950 experiments were informative.
For awhile it was part of the approved curriculum in schools. Not sure the date range on that.

There appears to be multiple applications of that data on different fronts . .black market, farma, etc.
Forgive me if I segway from the topic thread of Jedi and drugs.

Feel free to p.m.

Alethea- you wrote that,

I don't disagree, save when it comes to cigarettes. That's totally a chemical OR oral addiction. Depends on the person.

I don't mean to argue with you but I can't say from experience whether cigarettes are 'totally' a chemical 'OR' oral addiction. Can you personally say from your experience that you found cigarettes to be so? It's seems scientifically difficult to test this theory because science has to confine itself strictly to control groups in specific scenarios to attain precise data whereas in life there are so many influences! I wonder if the word, addiction might be too strong a word in regard to when you say 'oral addiction'. I think instead one might simply call it a habit. Cue- have a cigarette in your hand, routine- smoke cigarette, reward- drug release into the body's system, belief- not important in my argument. After stopping smoking, perhaps one craves putting something in their mouth like a pencil or pen to emulate the cigarette- and that's the 'oral addiction' or 'habit' (This is semantics I guess.) Perhaps it's just me- it sounds strange to me to call it an oral addiction,

Of course, I've personally watched people that when they got the attention, they relapsed because they just couldn't take the human connection anymore. They felt it was fake when their smoking (marijuana) buddies seemed more real.

The human connection mentionned in the article I think can be taken a step further to be not only with other people but also with oneself- people often beat themselves up or feel bad about themselves- human connection with others can help, but a better connection with yourself will work possibly better. I can imagine that the people you've seen didn't like the attention because they felt judged by that. I don't know whether when you say attention you mean unconditional 'love' whether they stop or start which is strongly suggested at the end of the article... I think even if one gives attention, if there's judgement in that attention (even if only perceived by the addicted person) you're more likely to push them away from you. Does that argument make sense to anyone?

"Loving an addict is really hard. When I looked at the addicts I love, it was always tempting to follow the tough love advice doled out by reality shows like Intervention -- tell the addict to shape up, or cut them off. Their message is that an addict who won't stop should be shunned. It's the logic of the drug war, imported into our private lives. But in fact, I learned, that will only deepen their addiction -- and you may lose them altogether. I came home determined to tie the addicts in my life closer to me than ever -- to let them know I love them unconditionally, whether they stop, or whether they can't."

Vusuki: The oral habit I've seen work with a lot of people replacing their cigarette with something else (first time I saw this was with a straw). But I've met plenty of people that the only way they could kick tobacco was by replacing it with the patch. The patch doesn't always work. I've also see people that use the e-cigs, those that tobacco isn't a thing it works, but for those that it is a thing they just can't use the e-cigs because it doesn't have enough tobacco content.

So the tobacco problem is as varied as people in general are.

Edan wrote: I suspect that connections with people is still an influencing factor on cigarettes though.
My fiance is finding it impossible to quit while we still have a lodger than smokes.

I don't know your lifestyle, you, your husband or your 'Lodger' So...Please do not take this as a critical thought on you guys. I am just thinking outloud.

But....Just because your Lodger smokes....dosn't mean you have to in order to be connected and sociable with said person.

I see that alot around here... "Well, I smoke so that I can be outside with my friends that also smoke" And I often wondered why one has to take up the habbit in order to hang out and socialize/have human contact. Don't have to do as they do to be with them.

Just...My thoughts on the matter.

I never smoked and wont ever smoke...ever. ( I get deathly Ill just being around the second hand smoke ) So I can't speak from experience. Just random thought process

Thanks V.
To the question in the middle. Yes.

I am not a professional in or related to the two following sets.

I am trained through old school oral tradition and practical application, and I have my experience in this neighborhood.
So . . . i would say speak the question in this way
Without unconditional acceptance, non-judgment, there is no space for a life-line
Or . . for a seed to be planted
Or . .for a bridge to be built

In terms of the family, and friends support system
I am trained through old school oral tradition and practical application, and I have my experience in this neighborhood.
Old school might say

let's first examine along these lines . . . if one thinks they want to leave the house, relationship, family due to addiction
*are you physically safe?
*while adults have the right to leave, go . . etc. . . . . a quick, impulsive decision was not recommended by the old school

the word 'boundary" penetrated those circles in a very unproductive way, in my opinion.

Kitsu Tails wrote:

Edan wrote: I suspect that connections with people is still an influencing factor on cigarettes though.
My fiance is finding it impossible to quit while we still have a lodger than smokes.

I don't know your lifestyle, you, your husband or your 'Lodger' So...Please do not take this as a critical thought on you guys. I am just thinking outloud.

But....Just because your Lodger smokes....dosn't mean you have to in order to be connected and sociable with said person.

I see that alot around here... "Well, I smoke so that I can be outside with my friends that also smoke" And I often wondered why one has to take up the habbit in order to hang out and socialize/have human contact. Don't have to do as they do to be with them.

Just...My thoughts on the matter.

I never smoked and wont ever smoke...ever. ( I get deathly Ill just being around the second hand smoke ) So I can't speak from experience. Just random thought process

It's not really about 'pub' socialisation though... my lodger is a friend and we are much like a family so we spend a lot of time with him. Both were smokers before they met. Their habits bounce off each other if you know what I mean; my fiance finds it impossible to quit because he is around it almost all the time; seeing my lodger smoke makes him want to smoke more. The same the other way around. I have seen the same in their friend group with others.

Kitsu Tails wrote:

Warning: Spoiler!

Edan wrote: I suspect that connections with people is still an influencing factor on cigarettes though.
My fiance is finding it impossible to quit while we still have a lodger than smokes.

I don't know your lifestyle, you, your husband or your 'Lodger' So...Please do not take this as a critical thought on you guys. I am just thinking outloud.

But....Just because your Lodger smokes....dosn't mean you have to in order to be connected and sociable with said person.

I see that alot around here... "Well, I smoke so that I can be outside with my friends that also smoke" And I often wondered why one has to take up the habbit in order to hang out and socialize/have human contact. Don't have to do as they do to be with them.

Just...My thoughts on the matter.

I never smoked and wont ever smoke...ever. ( I get deathly Ill just being around the second hand smoke ) So I can't speak from experience. Just random thought process

I think that your last bit kind of explains what Edan said. I have friends that smoke but I don't. When they want to smoke they go out and I don't because I too can't stand to be around the smell and the smoke. I then am the one cut off and alone, thus creating a desire to join in so that I can fit in. We all know that it's not necessary, but there will always be that part that thinks that it is and is almost willing to do the thing we hate so that we can be accepted.

Therefore, in order to feel connected to that individual or group we feel the need to smoke, if we don't then we feel disconnected. Also, my friends and family who have tried to quite all say that it is harder when around people who smoke. Like putting someone on a diet in a pizza shop (or other restaurant they'd enjoy). It will be harder.

All that said I will not drink or smoke or do drugs (not counting caffiene which I should really quite anyway) no matter how isolated I may feel from people.

Back to that article, I found that very interesting. Although it makes me wonder about the people who have lots of friends and family and still get addicted to drugs, alcohol, gambling, porn, or anything else really. If all that is required is a human connection than shouldn't everyone with a semi-decent support group be safe from addiction? As always, it is a very complex issue and this is but one aspect of it. It is an important one though. Thanks Vusuki.

Edit: Edan finished hers while I was typing. LOL